Talk:Leidang

This article is rated Start-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. It is of interest to the following WikiProjects:

Norse history and culture High‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Norse history and culture, a WikiProject related to all activities of the North Germanic peoples, both in Scandinavia and abroad, prior to the formation of the Kalmar Union in 1397. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.Norse history and cultureWikipedia:WikiProject Norse history and cultureTemplate:WikiProject Norse history and cultureNorse history and culture High This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. Military history: British / European / Nordic / Medieval This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status: Referencing and citation: criterion not met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion not met Associated task forces: /  British military history task force European military history task force Nordic military history task force Medieval warfare task force (c. 500 – c. 1500) Middle Ages Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Middle Ages, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the Middle Ages on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Middle AgesWikipedia:WikiProject Middle AgesTemplate:WikiProject Middle AgesMiddle Ages Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale. Anglo-Saxon Kingdoms Low‑importance This article is within the scope of WikiProject Anglo-Saxon Kingdoms, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Anglo-Saxon Kingdoms on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Anglo-Saxon KingdomsWikipedia:WikiProject Anglo-Saxon KingdomsTemplate:WikiProject Anglo-Saxon KingdomsAnglo-Saxon Kingdoms Low This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.

1. The term viking is never, ever mentioned in connection with ledung. Contrary, the ledung organization was established as fleet defence against vikings. (removing viking) Dan Koehl 14:48, 1 Dec 2004 (UTC)
2. The ledung was known before viking age and at least until +1300. What is so typical viking-age with it? What is the relevance for this remark, except to argue a connection between viking and ledung, in order to be able to proof that viking was a part of ledung system. (sounds crazy, but is an option in this case, I believe?Dan Koehl 20:05, 2 Dec 2004 (UTC)

In Denmark, the situation changed since 1134, when German cavalry appeared in the country. Before 1169, each Danish shipmaster had to bring a horse and a crossbow to the leiðangr ship. In 1169 the farmer's fleet levy disolved and was replaced by a smaller, professional army of the so called: "herræmæn" [herraemaen].

In Sweden a similar system was introduced before 1281. In Norway, at the end of the 12th century, the strategy for warfare changed: it was centered on a few "grand ships", and in contrast to Denmark, the farmers could still be called upon for active service, although in smaller numbers, e.g. six men out of a forty-man ship in 1273.

-- Ruhrjung 09:51 10 Jun 2003 (UTC)

The present sentence Viking Age Scandinavians. The leiðangr was however established long before the beginning of the Viking Age. shows very clearly that there is no need to use vikingage here, (normally said to be 800-1066) its more correct to use medevial (ca 450-1450) which much more reflect the time period the leadung was used. If noone has wellfouned objections, Ill change to medevial.Dan Koehl 13:35, 16 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Current understanding is that leiðangr was estabished in Scandinavia first in Denmark at the end of Viking Age and during the 11th century in Norway and Sweden. It was not a specifically Viking Age institution and certainly not early than that. The reason why it could not exist earlier is that it was a complicated, centralized system for creating naval transportation and required an organized, unified rule. There certainly were navies in Scandinavia before leiðangr, but those operated on different kind of basis. --Drieakko 09:57, 19 February 2007 (UTC)[reply]

If we use one article for both the English and Scandinavian institutions, we should probably use the English name on the English Wikipedia...

Yes indeed - frankly, it's bonkers to have an English language article which discusses this Anglo-Saxon feature under the guise of an "Anglo-Saxon version" of this Scandinavian system - it wasn't the same system. See for example here and here.Also, the assessment of the English "fyrd" as it stands is absurd - there was nothing "voluntary" about it, and it reads as though its members would merely kick a few stones around for a bit, get bored, and then go home. Whether or not that applied to its leaders is, as always, another matter. I'm in no doubt that "fyrd" should have its own article, and mentions of it here should be re-edited to reflect its separate status. Nortonius (talk) 18:34, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

So move or fork? Because the present situation is beyond absurd. 71.191.228.6 (talk) 05:17, 7 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

It has been suggested here that Fyrd should not be part of this article. Interested editors are invited to comment there.Monstrelet (talk) 07:48, 8 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I just copied the England section over to Fyrd and added the reflist for it. 74.96.48.77 (talk) 15:51, 5 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

"It is likely that the obligation of Englishmen to serve in the fyrd or peoples army is older than our oldest records."

Perhaps this should be written better? It's a bit fairy tale/ mythological in style, not very encyclopaediac or particularly informative... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.133.79.7 (talk) 23:32, 13 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Likewise, the article with a [citation needed] asserts that Alfred the Great created the fyrd. In 879. So: 1. He did not create the fyrd, which should be obvious from the "older than our oldest records" bit and 2. He merely reorganized it so that the militiamen came to serve in shifts so that he could have a standing army whose appearance was not dictated by harvest season. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.161.133.154 (talk) 03:37, 18 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

What does leidang mean? Leading? 惑乱 Wakuran (talk) 21:44, 21 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

In modern Icelandic, leið means path, and að leiða means to lead. Leiðangur (the modern spelling of leiðangr) means “a voyage with a purpose,” or the participants in such a voyage. That is the travel somewhere to do something (important), and the return back home.

Sagas on Heimskringla.no use it for military voyages—or military voyagers, as discussed in the article. Note that the act of going on a maritime military mission is written as something like að fara í leiðangr, while collecting taxes by naval blockade or as a part of an army is að herja. Að herja is the act of fighting and collecting taxes, and does not describe any voyage. Thus individuals are said to herja víða in Denmark or Scotland when they collect taxes at multiple points, whereas a leiðangr is a complete operation or a defensive navy squad of sorts.—SvartMan (talk) 20:25, 26 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]