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#indiewebcamp 2015-03-20

2015-03-20 UTC
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bengo "Each user should host it on their own servers and federated protocols should facilitate that" is the answer I'd go for :)
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tfontaine Since this is a decentralized thinking group. I'm just curious what you do for email. Do you let someone manage that, or do you host your own solution?
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kylewm tfontaine: I use fastmail with a custom domain
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kylewm my impression is that only a small handful of people here do host their own
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tfontaine I'm not surprised. Hosting email is a pain.
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kylewm indeed
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ben_thatmustbeme good first day
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ben_thatmustbeme though i realized i was wrong about something.. or i need to test it
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tfontaine I seem to recall a product that was self-hosted that ran entirely on your computer, but I can't seem to find it at the moment.
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tfontaine ie no server. I think it relied on remote servers queing mail until you came online.
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ben_thatmustbeme kylewm, how was our review of your UI
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kylewm motivating :)
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ben_thatmustbeme haha, nice
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kylewm very lucky to have a roomful of people give feedback on my design, only a little embarrassing
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ben_thatmustbeme i have to remember to correct myself with sandro and tantek. I said that browsers will drop referrer links when going http -> https. that is not true
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ben_thatmustbeme i was mixing something up
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WilliamDhalgren tfontaine: if it just downloads mail via imap, isn't that like every desktop mail client, or something like notmuch etc?
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ben_thatmustbeme s/links/headers/
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ben_thatmustbeme browsers drop the referrer headers when a link is tagged rel=nofollow
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kylewm what's the thing with https where analytics doesn't work anymore?
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ben_thatmustbeme at least from the testing i had done
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tfontaine It's more than that, WilliamDhalgren. I'm still searching for it, though it may be vaporware, which is why I can't find it now.
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ben_thatmustbeme http->https drops post values, and you lose cookies usually
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ben_thatmustbeme or sessions rather
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ben_thatmustbeme you can get cookies to work
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WilliamDhalgren anyone tried using the freedombox software for hosting their own stuff?
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WilliamDhalgren might make hosting mail practical enough. they've got some plug server support, rpi, beaglebone i think, and a generic support for whatever is capable running debian.
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WilliamDhalgren indieweb subreddit is set to private? odd choice
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WilliamDhalgren anyhow, I'll play w self-hosting some of the stuff at least. got a small arm box for such stuff
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ben_thatmustbeme there is an indieweb subreddit?
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WilliamDhalgren looks like it. and one set to private http://www.reddit.com/r/IndieWeb/
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@timmmmyboy #indiewebcamp Dinner at Cambridge 2015 https://twitter.com/timmmmyboy/status/578719954071080961/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/578719954071080961)
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@philipdurbin RT @timmmmyboy: #indiewebcamp Dinner at Cambridge 2015 https://twitter.com/timmmmyboy/status/578719954071080961/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/578723523918721024)
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@barryf Dinner with the #IndieWebCamp group in Cambridge, MA. Thanks to @tantek and Mozilla. https://twitter.com/barryf/status/578723641141030912/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/578723641141030912)
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fahrstuhl If I'm running Red Wind on my domain, how do I set up rel=me links to log in? o_o
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fahrstuhl Ah, wait, they go into the bio section in the config, if I get that right.
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KartikPrabhu kylewm++ wow redwind is getting more adoption
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Loqi kylewm has 142 karma
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fahrstuhl Yeah, I just rather like Python, so I thought I'd try Red Wind first.
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fahrstuhl Although "documentation is sparse right now" is no understatement xP
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KartikPrabhu fahrstuhl: yes. redwind was made by kylewm for his own use which is why documentation is sparse. Maybe there could be a wiki which enables a community documentation as redwind gets more adoption
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fahrstuhl KartikPrabhu: Yeah, I know, happens with my personal projects, too. (I did expect slightly more documentation because it's featured rather prominently on the projects page on the wiki but I think, I'll manage :D )
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fahrstuhl Yes, I did it!
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KartikPrabhu fahrstuhl: url?
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GWG I'm back, and I didn't get mugged on the dark streets of Cambridge
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fahrstuhl KartikPrabhu: what.re
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KartikPrabhu fahrstuhl++ for setting up redwind on own site
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Loqi fahrstuhl has 1 karma
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fahrstuhl KartikPrabhu: Thanks.
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fahrstuhl kylewm++ for developing Red Wind, which helped me join the indieweb
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Loqi kylewm has 143 karma
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tfontaine what is redwind
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Loqi Red Wind (source code) is Kyle Mahan's IndieWeb-ready blog software written in Python and running on Flask https://indiewebcamp.com/redwind
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tfontaine kylewm++ That's awesome.
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Loqi kylewm has 144 karma
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GWG kylewm: By the way, sorry about earlier
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@jimgroom @GIFmodel @timmmmyboy @indiewebcamp Absolutely clear, had no idea of the history until I read yr opus on her http://realdancingirl.tumblr.com/WHOAMI (twitter.com/_/status/578746154847977472)
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pdurbin good times at dinner tonight! nice seeing everyone!
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Loqi pdurbin: tantek left you a message 4 hours, 16 minutes ago: we are headed to The Asgard for dinner http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-03-19/line/1426803802395
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kylewm whoa nice job fahrstuhl!
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@HongPong RT @barryf: Dinner with the #IndieWebCamp group in Cambridge, MA. Thanks to @tantek and Mozilla. https://twitter.com/barryf/status/578723641141030912/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/578752622586363904)
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@HongPong RT @timmmmyboy: #indiewebcamp Dinner at Cambridge 2015 https://twitter.com/timmmmyboy/status/578719954071080961/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/578752647223779328)
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@MSVB28 #OwnYourData RT: "@jeffrey_oldham: Three out of four patients want easy data sharing between physicians http://t.co/2TNeAuVoDF” (twitter.com/_/status/578762129408409600)
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tantek what happens when I'm up too late and reading about silo-deaths: https://twitter.com/t/status/578764218209452032
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@t Google’s new mission: organize the world’s information, universally neglect it, & delete it. #googlecode #youhadonejob (ttk.me t4aD1) (twitter.com/_/status/578764218209452032)
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kylewm it's so cool how acegiak's profile photo is animated here: http://erinjo.is/2015/how-do-you-send-a-podcast-episode-to-someone-when
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tantek kylewm: indeed!
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acegiak hahaha! Excellent!
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acegiak I hadn't even thought of that!
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acegiak does a little dance
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kylewm does anyone have thoughts on onboarding for personal site software that uses indieauth? there's a bit of a chicken-egg problem there
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kylewm in that you can't sign in to indieauth until you set up the site, and you can't set up the site properly until you sign in (presumably with indieauth)
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tantek kylewm: yes we solved this
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kylewm !
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tantek step 1: nascar for indieauth/relmeauth capable oauth sites
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tantek step 2: setup their personal site with a rel=me to the indieauth/relmeauth capable oauth site they signed up with
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tantek step 3: there is no step 3
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GWG acegiak: By the way, pushed a bug fix for Post Kinds
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kylewm so i understand -- you run some installation script, it asks them to choose an oauth-capable site, using nascar links, and the instalation scripts pre-fills a rel=me for them?
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fahrstuhl what is nascar?
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Loqi The NASCAR problem is a reference to the jumble of branding icons on websites, e.g https://indiewebcamp.com/nascar
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kylewm that sentence was a disaster of pronouns and subject verb agreement
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kylewm trying again: the installation script prompts for a personal domain and one or more oauth-compatible rel-mes, and sets up the initial homepage for them
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tantek kylewm: it prefills rel=me to the silo profile and edits the siloprofile to point back to their new website as well (assuming their website field there was empty)
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kylewm ohh that would be really slick
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acegiak wait, what's the micropub endpoint for a withknown site?
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kylewm like, what's the url?
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kylewm acegiak: it's /micropub/endpoint, provided it has the indiepub plugin installed
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acegiak didn't realise I needed to enable it >.<
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acegiak hmm.. so I've enabled it. Still can'l login with quill or the indieauth tester :S
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acegiak ok trying to sign in with indieauth with dobbybot.withknown.com gives me "An unknown error occurred with this provider." for both twitter and google plus. Is this a known thing?
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acegiak ben!
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acegiak hey!
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acegiak so I'm trying to post to known from a python script
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acegiak but I'm having enough trouble getting even an auth token
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acegiak benwerd: http://imgur.com/HpWPhjT
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benwerd acegiak: we're in the process of redoing the main template, but try a more personal theme (which will have profile links on the front page): eg Cherwell or Solo
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acegiak it's running cherwell?
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acegiak brb
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Loqi slack/acegiak: ok on here while my irc machine reboots
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Loqi slack/acegiak: same issue with solo?
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Loqi slack/acegiak: benwerd: also is there a way I can get a list of comments with a script? a restful api or something?
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@leogaggl @theloveofwords @liminalcat Sorry - no #ello for me. I want to own data & stick with #indieweb + #opensource - check https://withknown.com/ (twitter.com/_/status/578794858577403904)
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benwerd_ Added Known as a stub Wikipedia entry after some advice: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Known_%28software%29 cc tommoris and others who know of the appropriate processes.
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benwerd_ acegiak: rereading your screenshot, something funky is happening with indieauth's integration with twitter
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benwerd_ it's finding the link just fine
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benwerd_ aaronpk may be able to shed some light
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WilliamDhalgren hi everyone!
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benwerd_ Howdy!
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WilliamDhalgren when one logs in via IndieAuth to a blog X, is one automatically logged in to a blog Y? or does one need to type in their domain and click on some confirm dialog all over again?
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WilliamDhalgren I mean, an appropriately compatible blog Y ofc
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WilliamDhalgren on an unrelated note, found out I have a right to a free domain! state provided. awfully official and fully connected to your civilian identiy but that's about perfect for a base of authentication :)
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acegiak WilliamDhalgren: indieauth for one site does not carry over to another
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WilliamDhalgren too bad. there are experiences in silos fundamentally incompatible with that approach
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WilliamDhalgren its prob possible to do improve upon it
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acegiak WilliamDhalgren: experiences such as?
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WilliamDhalgren like, I was thinking about somethin like circles in G+. segregating what content I show to which groups of people. but unless they're identified to the system when they look at my page, it can;t contain content tailored to them. Now to require them to log in for each person they follow likely becomes a chore fast, even if it is just one click and one text field.
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KartikPrabhu acegiak: perhaps WilliamDhalgren is refering to the fact the once you are logged into Twitter or such you don't have to re-enter your credentials to use Twitter log in on Medium for instance
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acegiak yeah having to log into the websites of my friends is an itch I haven't worked out how to scratch yet
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acegiak I think there's a solution with indieauth and something like browserid but just not sure how to do it
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WilliamDhalgren there is some distributed-indieauth page on the wiki, reads like its about doing just that
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KartikPrabhu the usual way to do it is use an indieauth cookie but I am not sure how consistent that is with indieweb principles
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acegiak yeah but you still need the initial login to all your friends sites then
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acegiak I feel like there's got to be a way my browser can automate the indieauth login though
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WilliamDhalgren there's a claim oauth can do that here I think http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/276262/how-can-i-build-a-seamless-login-for-multiple-sites-using-oauth2 "Try to create an end point on Site Y where Site X can pass an accessToken. Then Site Y will validate the accessToken being passed by Site X"
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WilliamDhalgren anyhow, seems like a small research project
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WilliamDhalgren wonder how one would scale this distribution of accessTokens and endpoints etc. something PUsH based possibly ... anyhow
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KartikPrabhu scaling is a plumbing issue. your UI/UX point is much better
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WilliamDhalgren just getting into all this, so I'm unhealthily obsessed with plumbing:D
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KartikPrabhu most of us are. but focusing more on the UI/UX issues already helps resolve the plumbing things
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WilliamDhalgren could crypto help? maybe I don't need to have people log in, I can show some encrypted gunk in some hidden div with some maigic class, controlled-access or whatever. some javascript can then select all those divs, try decripting with my public key, and replace & unhide any that work
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WilliamDhalgren could be a shared secret, not even anything as fancy as a public key, obtained when first logging into my site the IndieAuth way
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@johnjohnston RT @jimgroom: @GIFmodel @timmmmyboy @indiewebcamp Absolutely clear, had no idea of the history until I read yr opus on her http://t.co/BPlz… (twitter.com/_/status/578820014100328448)
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WilliamDhalgren presuming my content is static, and i have no robots.txt, what else is needed to be able to do site:my.domain.place in search engines?
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WilliamDhalgren btw very happy to have found out about the existence of this community! between my fond memories of blogging (and copious current passive consumption), avoidance of silos, and skepticism about the FSW approaches, this was quite a find. How big is this group anyhow?
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cweiske.de created /IndieAuthProtocol (+6279) "separate page for the IndieAuth protocol" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /authorization-endpoint () "(-5980) Move protocol spec to separate page" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /distributed-indieauth (+59) "/* Level 2: Host your own authorization server */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /IndieAuthProtocol (+245) "/* Identification header */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /IndieAuthProtocol (+329) "/* 3. Redirect to authorization endpoint */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /IndieAuthProtocol (+855) "/* 4. Verify user */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /login-brainstorming () "(-5063) content moved to [[IndieAuthProtocol]]" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /distributed-indieauth (-30) "/* Level 2: Host your own authorization server */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /indieweb-messaging (-2) (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /authorization-endpoint (-26) "/* See Also */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /Micropub (-2) "/* See Also */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /IndieAuth (+24) "/* See Also */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /h-x-app (-6) "/* See Also */" (view diff)
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cweiske.de edited /IndieAuthProtocol (+18) "/* 4. Verify user */" (view diff)
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cweiske fkooman, could you review https://indiewebcamp.com/IndieAuthProtocol if anything is missing?
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fkooman cweiske: sure!
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fkooman cweiske: i wish i could login to the wiki though ;-)
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cweiske that damn thing only supports relmeauth
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cweiske not indieauth
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fkooman cweiske: hmmm the indieauth instance MUST return the IndieAuth: authorization_endpoint header?
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fkooman the library does not enforce that though...
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cweiske which lib?
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cweiske indieauth-client-php?
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fkooman yeah
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fkooman the one http://monocle.p3k.io/ uses for example, it works with indiecert, but indiecert does not send this header
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fkooman i would also say that the authorization_endpoint on the user's homepage MUST be a 'https://...' URL
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cweiske always trying to exclude me
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fkooman it is not personal :)
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fkooman cweiske: it can be self signed of course or CAcert ;-)
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cweiske for you
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cweiske but other servers do not accept cacerts
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fkooman cweiske: ah yeah, true
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fkooman cweiske: except from the http:// instead of https:// it looks pretty good!
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fkooman https://indiecert.net/rp
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fkooman this also described the protocol more or less
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cweiske thanks for checking.
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fkooman cweiske: but maybe it makes sense to use X-IndieAuth as header instead of IndieAuth?
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cweiske no :)
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cweiske see https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6648
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cweiske Deprecating the "X-" Prefix and Similar Constructs in Application Protocols
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fkooman cweiske: i was checking this: http://www.iana.org/assignments/message-headers/message-headers.xml#perm-headers :)
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fkooman cweiske: I guess I'm old ;)
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cweiske I was used to X-, too
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fkooman i read the RFC, but still I don't agree...but well, it seems smarter people decided on this already, so the ship has sailed :)
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fkooman and added it to indiecert.net now: )
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fkooman nice solar eclise #berlin :)
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WilliamDhalgren hi again
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pdurbin WilliamDhalgren: hi
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ben_thatmustbeme hello all
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ben_thatmustbeme Woo, IWC Cambridge day 2 starts in a couple hours
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ben.thatmustbe.me created /2015/Cambridge/userinfo (+267) "dump from etherpad" (view diff)
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WilliamDhalgren oh its today! duh, I miscalculated because it was after midnight, thinking I just missed it
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WilliamDhalgren ben_thatmustbeme: there were morning sessions too, according to schedule, or?
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WilliamDhalgren nvm, though it was in UK
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pdurbin heh
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ben.thatmustbe.me created /2015/Cambridge/tilde (+691) "dump from etherpad" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me created /2015/Cambridge/messaging (+1470) "dump from etherpad" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me created /2015/Cambridge/drupal (+1972) "dump from etherpad, not sure of organization of this, there was little to no grouping on the etherpad" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me created /2015/Cambridge/kindsofposts (+1113) "dump from etherpad" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge/Schedule (+28) "/* Friday, March 20, 2015 (Hack Sessions) */" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge (-61) "correct photo display of image" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme s/image/schedule/
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ben_thatmustbeme rhiaro, you around? You had offered to help me pick up breakfast at whole foods
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge (+117) "/* Sponsors */" (view diff)
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pdurbin Does anyone know if https://gitter.im allows you to "liberate" your data? Or do they lock you in? I also asked at https://botbot.me/freenode/opensourcedesign/2015-03-20/?msg=34625667&page=1
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pdurbin looks like someone is asking here: https://gitter.zendesk.com/hc/communities/200009121/questions/200884931-Export-chat-history
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GWG Anyone around who speaks a language other than English?
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GWG I need some information.
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WilliamDhalgren a language? sure - I'm a native speaker of Croatian
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cweiske german
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GWG Okay...I'm trying to escape strings in something I'm writing for Indieweb for other languages.
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GWG So far, no one has sent me a translation, but it is good citizenship.
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GWG I'm going to write an example sentence...
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GWG I don't need a translation
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GWG I need to know if the words would go in the same order.
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cweiske depends on the sentence :)
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GWG In Reply to Fake Article by John Doe (Doe's World)
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GWG That's the sentence
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cweiske Antwort auf "Fake Article" von John Doe (Doe's Welt)
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GWG Basically, in <insert language here>, would the structure of the sentence work if just the words were substituted for the correct ones in another language?
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cweiske no
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GWG How so?
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cweiske there was a nice rant about that theme some months ago on hacker news
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GWG This is the sentence structure right now. VERB/ACTION [a post/tweet/etc]|TITLE^URL by AUTHOR (PUBLICATION|DOMAIN_NAME)
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GWG How would that structure be different?
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cweiske http://search.cpan.org/dist/Locale-Maketext/lib/Locale/Maketext/TPJ13.pod?#A_Localization_Horror_Story:_It_Could_Happen_To_You
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cweiske read all of it :)
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GWG cweiske: I could always just write it and wait for a foreign language speaker to ask me to fix it.
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cweiske or simply have a string with 3 variables in it
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@fjhirsch tired of stupid arbitrary twitter length limitations ,scratch itch with #indieweb (twitter.com/_/status/578912427791814656)
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tantek good morning #indiewebcamp!
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tantek hello adactio!
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adactio tantek: Hello!
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@benwerd @hughhancock That's certainly our argument, and that of the #indieweb community. Other forms of self - hosting are valid there, too. (twitter.com/_/status/578924016158691329)
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tantek adactio, you might find this amusing: https://twitter.com/search?f=realtime&q=%22js%3Bdr%22%20OR%20%22If%20it%E2%80%99s%20not%20curlable%2C%20it%E2%80%99s%20not%20on%20the%20web.%22
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tantek lol reddit: http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/2ys5nk/jsdr_javascript_required_didnt_read/
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pdurbin adactio: oh hi! If I haven't told you before I love https://huffduffer.com :)
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adactio pburbin: Yay!!! Thank you!
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adactio tantek: Sadface https://twitter.com/slightlylate/status/578801995160502272
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@slightlylate @smashingmag @t : what a sad, small view of content. (twitter.com/_/status/578801995160502272)
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tantek adactio - it's ok, his actions are to post HTML, rather than JS. which speak louder than his words.
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adactio tantek: Happyface
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tantek perhaps I should reply accordingly
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csarven tantek I'm totally going to steal "pdf;dr".
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tantek csarven: all yours :)
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tantek csarven: that's especially popular among the academics >:D
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csarven Specifically among "researchers" that do "Web" "Science"
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ben_thatmustbeme i feel like i should have taken a photo of the way i brought in food this morning
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ben_thatmustbeme has got to be the first delivery by dr who scarf
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tantek adactio: https://twitter.com/t/status/578932225934159872
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@t @slightlylate fortunately your action (post on a site with HTML content) speaks louder than your words ;) @smashingmag (ttk.me t4aE1) (twitter.com/_/status/578932225934159872)
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Acidnerd can someone point me to the microformat2 plugin for wordpress ?
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Acidnerd i cant find it back
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bret Acidnerd: is it listed here? http://indiewebcamp.com/wordpress
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Acidnerd thanks, of course the wiki !
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bret i dont have much experience navigating the available plugins
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Acidnerd found it back
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Acidnerd https://github.com/pfefferle/wordpress-uf2
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Acidnerd from the wiki list
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Acidnerd not sure it will work, but i'll try to get this running now
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tantek.com created /2015/Cambridge/Hack_Day_Intro (+1056) "clone from 2014" (view diff)
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tantek__1 https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Cambridge/Hack_Day_Intro
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kylewm snarfed: just a heads up, I'm seeing errors with instagram-activitystreams, but can't reproduce locally. I'm going to try deploying the latest code
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bret what are people working on today?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "people working on today" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=people+working+on+today&summary=prompted+by+bret+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-03-20%2Fline%2F1426866347603
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ben_thatmustbeme quite a lot actually
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ben_thatmustbeme we have a rather full grid
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ben_thatmustbeme let me see if I can get a photo that is useful
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bret ben_thatmustbeme++
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Loqi ben_thatmustbeme has 54 karma
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kylewm !tell aaronpk maybe interesting for you in monocle, you can enter a search query in twitter-activitystreams.appspot.com now (it's experimental/undocumented so far), e.g. /@me/@search/@app/?q=indieweb&format=html
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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ben_thatmustbeme https://ben.thatmustbe.me/upload/photo/29614
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@nobantu Final Hours of RegularTickets for #IIW XX: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/internet-identity-workshop-xx-20-2015a-tickets-14097972415 #identity #privacy #VRM #CRM #IoT #UMA #indieweb #unConference (twitter.com/_/status/578948358468857858)
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@IPACSO RT @nobantu: Final Hours of RegularTickets for #IIW XX: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/internet-identity-workshop-xx-20-2015a-tickets-14097972415 #identity #privacy #VRM #CRM #IoT #UMA #indieweb #unCo… (twitter.com/_/status/578948362587746304)
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GWG By the way, the talky is online at talky.io/indiewebcamp
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GWG If you want to see us hack
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GWG !tell acegiak I'm about to make you do work.
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Loqi Ok, I'll tell them that when I see them next
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Loqi slack/snarfed: kylewm thanks! yeah it's probably been a while since the last deploy
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@AnonMohandas managed to integrate social activity at @intoxvsinfo very raw for now but http://www.intoxvs.info/anonymous/opddd-boycott-the-dailydot-fucksabu/ #indieweb https://twitter.com/AnonMohandas/status/578958448743833600/photo/1 (twitter.com/_/status/578958448743833600)
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@Deatheatersholl RT @AnonMohandas: managed to integrate social activity at @intoxvsinfo very raw for now but http://www.intoxvs.info/anonymous/opddd-boycott-the-dailydot-fucksabu/ #indieweb http://t.co/v7… (twitter.com/_/status/578958593128529921)
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@AnonymousHQInfo RT @AnonMohandas: managed to integrate social activity at @intoxvsinfo very raw for now but http://www.intoxvs.info/anonymous/opddd-boycott-the-dailydot-fucksabu/ #indieweb http://t.co/v7… (twitter.com/_/status/578959061061910528)
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tantek.com edited /rsvp (-60) "reference draft p-rsvp property" (view diff)
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tantek lunch is ready at IndieWebCamp Cambridge! Thanks very much to sponsor Reclaim Hosting
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tantek.com edited /2015/Cambridge/Planning (+4) "sponsor updates" (view diff)
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tantek.com edited /2015/Cambridge/Planning (+13) "header summary with link to higher level pages" (view diff)
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aaronpk wow this looks like it's gonna be a highly productive hack day!
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Loqi aaronpk: kylewm left you a message 57 minutes ago: maybe interesting for you in monocle, you can enter a search query in twitter-activitystreams.appspot.com now (it's experimental/undocumented so far), e.g. /@me/@search/@app/?q=indieweb&format=html http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-03-20/line/1426866673919
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aaronpk kylewm: that's heat
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aaronpk neat*
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@kirilind Ten use cases for a Personal Server #d14n #indieweb https://michielbdejong.com/2015/personal-server-use-cases (twitter.com/_/status/578963009348960256)
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bret KevinMarks: your fetch meme was A+
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@pierreozoux Ten use cases for a Personal Server #d14n #indieweb https://michielbdejong.com/2015/personal-server-use-cases https://kirilind.me/2015/ten-use-cases-for-a-personal-server-d14n-indieweb-2015personal-server-use-cases https://microblog.pierre-o.fr/2015/ten-use-cases-for-a-personal-server-d14n-indieweb-2015personal-server-use-cases (twitter.com/_/status/578963421766557696)
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benwerd .j #vuc
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benwerd Hooray for IRC typos; sorry
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jonnybarnes right, finally got HTML Purifier working again, so alanpearce’s twitter reply is now on my site via bridgy.
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jonnybarnes but now his profile pic isn't showing and I don't know why
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jonnybarnes https://jonnybarnes.uk/notes/6o
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alanpearce Magic.
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jonnybarnes oh, got it
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alanpearce I can see it.
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alanpearce Yeah.
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jonnybarnes firefox was blocking it
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jonnybarnes Disabled "Tracking protection" and it appeared again
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jonnybarnes also alanpearce: are you saying prism.js is a js;dr problem in general?
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alanpearce Yeah
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alanpearce I read the site for a while thinking "okay, sounds interesting, but what is it"
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alanpearce Then I realised the examples were missing
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alanpearce Have you considered proxying profile pictures? I can't see mine on that note even when I allow requests to twitter.com in RequestPolicy
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jonnybarnes I proxy profile pictures when they're not from twitter :/
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alanpearce Aha. :D
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jonnybarnes i.e. a native webmention should get a proxied pic
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jonnybarnes image back alanpearce ?
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alanpearce Nope. Disconnect was blocking it as well
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alanpearce Sometimes I see the web very differently from other people :D
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jonnybarnes oh, I only implemented any kind of proxying to get round non-https warnings
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jonnybarnes didn't realise things were going to block twitter links :(
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alanpearce Heh. Funny actually, getting the image from twitter takes ages
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alanpearce 500ms over two requests
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alanpearce Man, I want to start working on this stuff again
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jonnybarnes woah 500ms, thats ridic
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GWG Okay, deployed.
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torrorist has anyone out there ever set up an indieweb site on a tor hidden service? i'm going to try to do it shortly here
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benwerd torrorist: there's been some work to do that with Known on a Freedom Box
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ben.thatmustbe.me uploaded /Special:Log/upload "uploaded "[[File:IWCCambridge hack grid.jpg]]""
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge (+38) "/* Photos */" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge (+5) "/* Photos */" (view diff)
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barryf ben_thatmustbeme http://new.aprilzero.com is the personal data site we were talking about
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barryf ben_thatmustbeme and Gyroscope is the (upcoming) product https://gyrosco.pe
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@Andre0Ani RT @pierreozoux: Ten use cases for a Personal Server #d14n #indieweb https://michielbdejong.com/2015/personal-server-use-cases https://kirilind.me/2015/ten-use-cases-for-a-personal-server-d14n-indieweb-2015personal-server-use-cases https://microblog.pierre-o.fr/2015/ten-use-cases-for-a-personal-server-d14n-indieweb-2015personal-server-use-cases (twitter.com/_/status/578975621453332480)
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tantek thought with rhiaro the other night: POSSE note with photos - send first 4 photos in note to Twitter, instead of having them linked in tweet
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tantek on the topic of /site-deaths : https://twitter.com/t/status/578764218209452032
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@t Google’s new mission: organize the world’s information, universally neglect it, & delete it. #googlecode #youhadonejob (ttk.me t4aD1) (twitter.com/_/status/578764218209452032)
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@OpDeathEatersUS RT @AnonMohandas: managed to integrate social activity at @intoxvsinfo very raw for now but http://www.intoxvs.info/anonymous/opddd-boycott-the-dailydot-fucksabu/ #indieweb http://t.co/v7… (twitter.com/_/status/578977291621031936)
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tantek what is reddit?
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Loqi Reddit is a link aggregator and bulletin board site where community members may submit links and text posts, vote on the submitted entries, and post comments on them https://indiewebcamp.com/Reddit
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@TwistAnonymous RT @AnonMohandas: managed to integrate social activity at @intoxvsinfo very raw for now but http://www.intoxvs.info/anonymous/opddd-boycott-the-dailydot-fucksabu/ #indieweb http://t.co/v7… (twitter.com/_/status/578977874608320512)
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ben_thatmustbeme http://www.reddit.com/r/indieweb
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tantek what is hackernews?
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Loqi Hacker News is a bookmark posting silo as well as a silo for comments on those links https://indiewebcamp.com/hackernews
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ben_thatmustbeme what is the game
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "game" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=game&summary=prompted+by+ben_thatmustbeme+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-03-20%2Fline%2F1426874081782
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ben_thatmustbeme the game is you have just lost the game
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loqi.me created /game (+62) "prompted by ben_thatmustbeme https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-03-20/line/1426874081782 and dfn added by ben_thatmustbeme" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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ben_thatmustbeme sorry
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tantek what is after the game?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "after the game" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=after+the+game&summary=prompted+by+tantek+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-03-20%2Fline%2F1426874188041
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tantek after the game is before the game. — S. Herberger
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loqi.me created /after_the_game (+78) "prompted by tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-03-20/line/1426874188041 and dfn added by tantek" (view diff)
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Loqi ok
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tilgovi what is silo
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Loqi A silo, or web content hosting silo, in the context of the IndieWeb, is a centralized web site typically owned by a for-profit corporation that stakes some claim to content contributed to it and restricts access in some way (has walls) https://indiewebcamp.com/silo
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torrorist who is loqi?
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Loqi Loqi is a friendly and useful bot present in the #indiewebcamp IRC channel and other channels https://indiewebcamp.com/User:Loqi.me
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ben_thatmustbeme what is 42
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Loqi The Answer to the Ultimate Question of Life, The Universe, and Everything is … 42 https://indiewebcamp.com/42
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tilgovi where are the Snowdens of yesteryear?
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ben_thatmustbeme hmmm, annoying problem, php-comments doesn't actually give me back what the post was actually in reply to, if it figures it to be a mention
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ben_thatmustbeme not important for mention, important for tagging
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benwerd Is anyone aware of a PHP shim for xmlrpc_decode?
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benwerd * a decent PHP shim
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tantek steps back slowly
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aaronpk benwerd: no, just regex it
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aaronpk (if it's for pingback which I assume it is)
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benwerd aaronpk: yes; ok, will do
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benwerd thanks
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aaronpk i think i did that in one of my libraries
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tantek webmention.io?
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aaronpk that's in ruby
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tantek.com edited /event (+241) "collapse Silo Examples, sort FB, most recent to top" (view diff)
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julien51 Is there anyone in here who uses PubSubHubbub with HTML without HTTP link headers? We’re looking for real world usage to make sure https://github.com/superfeedr/documentation/issues/61 is fixed)
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Loqi julien51: kylewm left you a message on 9/12 at 12:59pm: is Radio3 open source, or would it be a matter of sending webmentions on their behalf?
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tantek hello julien51!
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tantek julien51: I'm happy to change my site to test that :D
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julien51 awesome! tantek! Well, let’s try
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tantek (aaronpk and I did verify that it worked with the HTTP Link Headers and HTML content discovery / notification)
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julien51 yup
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julien51 it’s just that we did not discover <meta> <link>’s up until earlier today
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julien51 I believe this is fixed, but realu world is always better than test suite!
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+64) "/* event posts */ note presentational goal" (view diff)
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tantek julien51: meta?
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tantek do you mean meta http-equiv?!?
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julien51 yeah, inside the html’s <meta> you can add <link rel=“hub”> (similar to <link rel=“webmention” for example)
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julien51 yup
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julien51 sorry, no
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aaronpk i think you mean <head>
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tantek oh you mean <head>
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julien51 yeah, sorry, I meant <head>!
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julien51 that said we should also support meta-equiv me thinks
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tantek julien51: I wouldn't bother until someone asks
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tantek now what you *should* support is not needing rel="self"
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tantek or rather, absent rel="self", default to the URL itself as self
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tantek in fact I'll update with that
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aaronpk julien51: i was wondering about that... what is the reason for specifying rel=self? when would it be different from the URL?
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aaronpk wasn't sure if there was a reason or if it was left over from a previous version of the spec
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julien51 well, the “rel="self”” is indeed a bit tricky
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julien51 the reason for specifying the self is because we will only get pings for a specific url frm the publishers
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julien51 so we need to make sure the subscriber uses that same url
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julien51 hence the rel=“self”
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aaronpk julien51: so I have this problem where aaronpk.com redirects to aaronparecki.com, and people have subscribed to both URLs now
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aaronpk would this help solve that somehow?
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kylewm it's useful for when a site that serves both http and https
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kylewm rel-self is
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julien51 kylewm exactly that’s one of the common problems
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julien51 also / and /index.html for example
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aaronpk julien51: so what's stopping someone else from setting rel=self on their site to my topic URL and overriding or otherwise messing up subscriptions?
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julien51 or even things with upcase/downcase
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tantek ah because rel="self" is easier than fixing http redirects to do the right thing
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julien51 tantek: yes
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tantek ok
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julien51 aaronpk: nothing, but if you subscribe to the *wrong* self, you can’t expect to get pings
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julien51 in practice, at superfeedr we *try* to be smart
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aaronpk it would be nice if being a hub or a consumer didn't require being "smart" outside of the spec
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julien51 exactly, which is why I think the self *is* important
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hongpong ball of twine coordinates http://tools.wmflabs.org/geohack/geohack.php?pagename=Biggest_ball_of_twine&params=45.096332_N_-94.410276_E_type:landmark_region:US-MN_scale:500
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kylewm aaronpk: "overriding or otherwise messing up" == sending unnecessary pings?
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julien51 “”Be conservative in what you do, be liberal in what you accept from others”
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hongpong 45.096332°N 94.410276°W
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kylewm or is there something more nefarious that someone could do
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aaronpk kylewm: i'm not sure...
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tantek julien51: ok tantek.com updated
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julien51 yay
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julien51 let’s check then!
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tantek but I haven't done any new posts - let me know when you need one
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julien51 will do
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julien51 I think we’re good:
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julien51 curl -X POST "https://pubsubhubbub.superfeedr.com/" -d'hub.mode=subscribe' -d'hub.topic=http://tantek.com/' -d'hub.callback=http://requestb.in/x47wv7x4' -D-
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julien51 and now tantek, if you will, please add a new thing to http://tantek.com/ and ping your hub :)
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tantek ok
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julien51 you can inpect data sent to your subscriber at http://requestb.in/x47wv7x4?inspect
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julien51 I did susbcribe twice (first time I forgot to tail our logs… :(), so you see 2 verifications of intent
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aaronpk sayt hat gives me an idea...
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aaronpk a site like requestb.in but that pretends to be a PuSH subscriber
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julien51 we should see a POST request there as soon as 1) you update tantek.com (in any way… it’s HTML do no smart diffing- and 2) you ping us
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Loqi +1
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julien51 aaronpk: requestb.in actually does that :)
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aaronpk what!
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julien51 at least they implement the verification of intent (which is the only thing that I can think of!)
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aaronpk yeah
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge (+0) "/* Schedule */ correct demos time" (view diff)
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge (+0) "/* Schedule */ correcting close time" (view diff)
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@t Lots of personal site hacking @indiewebcamp today! https://indiewebcamp.com/images/5/59/IWCCambridge_hack_grid.jpg More photos: https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Cambridge#Photos (ttk.me t4aE2) (twitter.com/_/status/578992359569928192)
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge/Schedule (+0) "/* Friday, March 20, 2015 (Hack Sessions) */ correct times for day 2 schedule" (view diff)
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tantek julien51: did that work?
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kylewm tantek: I got a ping from your site in woodwind!
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julien51 Id did: http://requestb.in/x47wv7x4?inspect :)
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tantek woot!
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Loqi :D
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julien51 to requestb.in truncates things, but you have everything in there :)
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julien51 the only thing is that there are 3 notifications, which is a bit odd
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ben.thatmustbe.me edited /2015/Cambridge (+149) "/* Photos */" (view diff)
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tantek hmm - ok I'll leave my code alone and we can try to debug if you wish julien51
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julien51 tantek I think it’s good, the tripilcates are actually because requestb.in did not reply with 200 the first times
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julien51 2015-03-20T18:43:30-04:00 192.168.175.14 info Failed attempt to notify http://requestb.in/s9amlss9 500
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julien51 I’ll try to debug that, but I think it’s not related to tantek.com :)
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julien51 thanks for you time!
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kylewm julien51++ great new feature! thanks for adding
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Loqi julien51 has 3 karma
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julien51 kylewm we should have that a long time ago…
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julien51 it’s really isn’t a problem :)
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aaronpk hooray!
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aaronpk julien51: did you see my note on section 5.1.1? https://github.com/pubsubhubbub/PubSubHubbub/issues/31
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julien51 yup, haven’t had time to review yet
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aaronpk cool. wasn't sure who was looking at that repo still
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tantek julien51++ thanks for making PuSH 0.4 work for HTML with just HTML <link>!
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Loqi julien51 has 4 karma
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julien51 aaronpk gotta take care of diner… BUT I’ll look at this during the weekend or early next week
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tantek kylewm: are you (in Woodwind) subscribed to my home page or my atom feed?
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julien51 there’s something else we’re about to release which might be useful in the context of webmentions :)
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julien51 stay tunes!
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kylewm tantek: home page
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julien51 tuned!
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aaronpk cool!
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tantek both should be sending PuSH notifications now via superfeedr
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tantek kylewm: awesome! so you should get all my posts in real time then!
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tantek e.g. when I post more than 3 likes at a time
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barnabywalters julien51++ thanks for implementing this! My homepage feed will finally work properly :)
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tantek (since atom feed is limited to just most recent posts)
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Loqi barnabywalters: tantek left you a message 3 days, 6 hours ago: I finally fixed timezones in Falcon posts and deployed (tantek.com) - see if your readers (or other contexts) work. Tested with both phpmf2 and mf2py and parsed output looks good. http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-03-17/line/1426594591595
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Loqi barnabywalters: aaronpk left you a message 3 days, 5 hours ago: looking good in Monocle! https://monocle.p3k.io/preview?url=https://waterpigs.co.uk/notes/4a8FcA/ http://indiewebcamp.com/irc/2015-03-17/line/1426599999499
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Loqi julien51 has 5 karma
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barnabywalters tantek: yup, can confirm that posts on tantek.com now show up with good timezones! Your like-posting is excellent incentive for me to build better like presentation into shrewdness :)
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tantek aaronpk++ for writing up http://indiewebcamp.com/How_to_publish_and_consume_PubSubHubbub which made it much easier to understand how to make it work
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Loqi aaronpk has 748 karma
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kylewm barnabywalters: just heads up that you're on pubsubhubbub.appspot.com right now, if you didn't know
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barnabywalters aaronpk: awesome work on monocle! Glad to see my posts are looking good there :)
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tantek barnabywalters: love it. encouraging each other with getting more stuff working on each of our sites!
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barnabywalters kylewm: thanks for the reminder, I probably moved it to appspot because I couldn’t figure out why superfeedr wasn’t working properly
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barnabywalters this was before people here had figured out it was the Link: vs <link> thing
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julien51 barnabywalters should that happen again you MUST bug me!
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tantek julien51: great to see you here again in IRC and I hope it's been helpful!
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barnabywalters julien51: will do :) IIRC at the time I was fed up of trying to get PuSH and other plumbing working and wanted to concentrate on making shrewdnes nice to look at
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tantek I'm going to keep both my home page and atom feed PuSH updates going for now BTW.
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kylewm barnabywalters: did appspot.com work for your h-feed in shrewdness??
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barnabywalters kylewm: not noticeably, at which point I was bored of working on plumbing and didn’t give it much more thought
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kylewm oh, good call ok :) i was going to be surprised since the appspot.com one didnt seem to work for me at all
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aaronpk the problem with appspot is it's almost completely invisible
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aaronpk there's no feedback or visibility into anything, so it's very frustrating to use
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aaronpk at least with superfeedr you can see a list of active subscriptions
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barnabywalters aaronpk: does monocle do realtime updates? are you using your node.js websockets server for that?
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aaronpk barnabywalters: it doesn't yet, but I plan to with the node websockets server
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barnabywalters PHP+[web server of your choice]’s inability to effectively serve eventsource or websocket connections without a separate process+proxying is very close to putting me off developing shrewdness’s backend in PHP
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tantek aaronpk: and it doesn't look like anyone's doing maintenance on the appspot one. and it's on Google Code still :(
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aaronpk barnabywalters: yeah I was experimenting with eventsource in php but it really doesn't want to behave that way
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aaronpk i do think the simple node.js (or ruby) websockets proxy is good enough though
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aaronpk especially if I can run it behind an nginx reverse proxy so it's on the same domain+port+ssl
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barnabywalters aaronpk: for personal usage yeah, but I really want shrewdness to be something other people can run easily
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aaronpk barnabywalters: ah yeah... that makes it harder
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barnabywalters when I get back to working on it, the plan is to make elasticsearch optional, to make it more accessible for people to run
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aaronpk I don't know if you Ruby at all, but this framework supports regular http plus websockets https://github.com/kenichi/angelo
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aaronpk tantek: yeah at this point I'm just gonna ignore the google one, it pretty much doesn't exist as far as i'm concerned
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tantek which is a problem in terms of bus count
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tantek we need more hubs running for PuSH to continue as a viable open standard
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aaronpk working on it ;)
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tantek lol
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aaronpk right now actually
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ben_thatmustbeme barnabywalters, left you messages in #microformats
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barnabywalters ben_thatmustbeme: thanks, looking!
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kylewm barnabywalters: hit the nail on the head in terms of what i've been looking for too, language/framework-wise
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aaronpk kylewm: you should take a look at Angelo and see if you can make an equivalent in Python
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barnabywalters kylewm: I think go would be ideal for a project like this, but the prospect of rebuilding mf parsing, indieauth, subscriptions etc. infrastructure in another language is daunting, to say the least
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barnabywalters not what I want to spend time on. I’ll probably end up trying to make shrewdness work standalone PHP+[]sql, with things like elasticsearch or a separate websockets server for real time updates as drop-in extras
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barnabywalters i.e. a settings UI with input fields for Elasticsearch URL and websocket server URL
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aaronpk that seems reasonable
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tantek.com edited /Falcon (+72) "/* event posts */ clarify what fields I want to display in roughly what order / cardinality" (view diff)
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kylewm aaronpk: i would love to undertake something like that. this is by far the biggest pain point with the python2/3 divide
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kylewm python2 has excellent library support for go-style coroutines
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kylewm python3 has a totally new asyncio package
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kylewm (it is a bummer)
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kylewm and so few people are using python 3 that i could actually make a difference
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aaronpk wow crazy
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cweiske my hub is at 20%
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aaronpk you're building one too?
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cweiske yep
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cweiske phubb
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aaronpk sweet
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cweiske I'm pondering how to to the inter process communication
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cweiske from the php process that handles the subscription to the one that does verification
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aaronpk i use beanstalkd as a worker queue and have a separate background task that processes stuff
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cweiske how do you start the task after booting?
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aaronpk an ubuntu init script
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cweiske manual?
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cweiske ly written?
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aaronpk yeah but it's like 5 lines
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cweiske could you paste that one please?
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kylewm aaronpk: Upstart?
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cweiske I originally was searching for something that I only had to register my app with, and which took care of the init processes and restarts (when the php process crashes) automatically
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kylewm as opposed to old school init
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aaronpk kylewm: whatever 12.04 and 14.04 use, not init.d
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@iamaegibson Haha! #ownyourgram works! Guess I'll start using Instagram more. Yay #indieweb http://aegibson.com/s/4S8zd (twitter.com/_/status/579003234263654400)
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kylewm cool that's waht i ended up doing too, after a foray into supervisord
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aaronpk cweiske: https://gist.github.com/aaronpk/bf3646ee7cccb7ad63bd
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snarfed fun experiment: i'm indie liking https://kylewm.com/2015/03/repost-of-jenn-money-i-enjoy-sexual-humor-but-it , which is a retweet, and posseing as a favorite. will it show up as a fave on the original tweet? stay tuned!…
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snarfed success!
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snarfed k back to work
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kylewm oh nice! I dont' think redwind handles that correctly actually :)
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bret aaronpk: I added the push hub stuff to my index
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bret aaronpk: if you waned a site to test with
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tantek EARLY DEMO!
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tantek from bigbluehat
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GWG Live stream is back on
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GWG "This is another side project that I tinker on..."
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GWG "http had a proposed link/unlink method..."
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GWG This would be a similar process to webmention
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GWG Right now, the link just writes into CouchDB
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kylewm bret: it worked!
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bret monocle isnt showing the ping
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bret did you get one?
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kylewm actually no, sorry
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kylewm i got a ping from your atom feed
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bret :[
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bret well thats good
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bret this should be working
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kylewm bret: sorry i wasn't subscribed to your push hub yet
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kylewm now i am, should work in the future
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tantek bigbluehat demonstrated an implementation of https://indiewebcamp.com/webmention#LINK_verb
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tantek which is an alternative method of link notifications
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GWG Next presentation in a few minutes
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bret GWG++
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Loqi GWG has 88 karma
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snarfed barryf: trying out your last.fm integration with bridgy?
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bret kylewm: not sure if your system picks up updates
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bret but I just edited that post slightly
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kylewm bret: no ping yet
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bret :(
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bret ill have to wait for julien then
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barryf snarfed: I don't think so, although I may have accidentally sent some webmentions earlier?
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snarfed barryf: yeah from localhost. np! just stalking today's demos :P
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barryf snarfed: whoops, yes shut that down now :)
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snarfed no harm
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tantek second demo: Jim from Reclaim Hosting
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bret possible to get a beter video view? no worries if its a hassle
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tantek demonstrated tilde.club, thumbnails of DS106 students
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bret getting just the corner
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tantek and got Usenet support installed on his tilde club instance
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tantek ...
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tantek third demo
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tantek Got Known working on an onion address
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tantek Cassie and Kurt
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tantek shows Known working on a ******.onion URL
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tantek one issue was curl not installed
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tantek on Freedom Hosting 2
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tantek they have PHP on there
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tantek but no access install more libraries
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bret thankyou to whoever adjusted the camera
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GWG bret: You are welcome
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bret GWG :)
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tantek also went out and bought a computer real quick off of craigslist
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GWG That's dedication
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tantek ...
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tantek next demo
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tantek rhiaro: was going to work on event posts, but instead worked on fixing publishing flow
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tantek when started with website, pre indieweb, goal was to write posts in markdown
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tantek and then run a script to post / show them
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tantek got creating posts working
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tantek added updating posts
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tantek previously had to manually delete them in database
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tantek also added event RSVP
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tantek start date, end date, rsvp with value of yes and in-reply-to the event
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KevinMarks damn, missing demos due to gillmor gang, thought they were later
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tantek.com edited /2015/Cambridge (+170) "add indie event and FB POSSE copy" (view diff)
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GWG This should accept webmentions if you want to test: https://tiny.n9n.us/2014/04/26/favoriting-the-post/
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tantek.com edited /event (+1080) "/* Brainstorming */ Markup design" (view diff)
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tantek ...
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ben_thatmustbeme who is watching the feed
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ben_thatmustbeme tantek is showing what his design would be for his events
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bret rhiaro: are all the SPARQL endpoints really dead? http://labs.mondeca.com/sparqlEndpointsStatus/ (just reading through some of your old slogd posts
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ben_thatmustbeme and from there is working backward from the design to get list of fields he needs to create that markup
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rhiaro bret: not all of them!
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ben_thatmustbeme list includes name of the event, featured photo, start of the event, location (with venue, url, map-photo)
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ben_thatmustbeme ... h-card is a venue but how do you know what urls are a photo of the venue or the url of the map, is the photo a map photo, or thelocation photo?
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hongpong GWG: i think it needs to be a Plain regular post, not a Favorite. this doesnt seem to have an endpoint
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ben_thatmustbeme ... also description, attendees (hcards), responses (as an h-feed)
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GWG hongpong: https://david.shanske.com/2015/03/19/at-indiewebcamp/
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GWG Here, my live site. It shouldn't give you trouble.
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ben_thatmustbeme thats as far as he got today, but the next step after this is to start with a plain text version then work up to his markup
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ben_thatmustbeme all of this is added to /event
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bret.io edited /2015/Cambridge/Guest_List (+465) "/* Remote Participants */ im remote!" (view diff)
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ben_thatmustbeme some people have every event is an h-entry, he believes there should be a seperation of "create an event" as an h-entry in your feed, vs an h-event which is something different
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ben_thatmustbeme jim: once you have these events, how do you get a aggregation of events across places?
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bret it already supports mf2
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ben_thatmustbeme tantek: event aggregator would be great, something like this in lanyrd. This could be done via posse maybe, but it would be nicer to just be able to send a webmention and have it read all the data directly in
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ben_thatmustbeme ... now that PuSH is starting to get some use (just got that working on own site) perhaps calligator or lanyrd would be able to consume PuSH and just watch for h-entries
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ben_thatmustbeme ... and thereby get instant event updates once they are subscribed to your site.
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ben_thatmustbeme rhiaro: opentechcalendar is working toward being able to integrate with indieweb events
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bret http://calagator.org/
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bret http://glennjones.net/tools/microformats/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcalagator.org%2Fevents%2F1250468003&filters=&callback=
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tantek ...
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme has been working on person tagging
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tantek shows terminal
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tantek shows some HTML + microformats
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tantek of an h-entry
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tantek example from /person-tagging
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tantek Alice tagging Bob on Cal's post
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tantek shows that mf2 parser is finding the information from the markup
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tantek showed his code getting a notification when he gets tagged
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tantek checked to see if he could get both types of notifications
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tantek both that he has been tagged in someone else's post
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tantek and that a post of his has been tagged.
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tantek ...
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tantek next demo
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tantek ...
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tantek Tim Owens
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tantek shipyard
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ben_thatmustbeme timmmmyboy: showing shipyard
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rhiaro aaronpk, I sent a supposedly correctly formatted rsvp to your social f2f event... third time lucky?
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ben_thatmustbeme has 3 docker containers, 2 different dbs and 1 running shipyard
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bret rhiaro: looks like it!
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bret https://aaronparecki.com/events/2015/03/17/1/socialwg-2015
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rhiaro yay!
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Loqi giggles
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bret wooop!
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ben_thatmustbeme got 2 different machines (digital ocean) up and running and connected to shipyard instance
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bret rhiaro: set up a pic! http://indiewebify.me/ can test fot that
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bret for*
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rhiaro yeah I know that's missing
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rhiaro I don't know why it doesn't say attending
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rhiaro I have value="yes" in my rsvp
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ben_thatmustbeme stores cert files and doing health checks on them
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rhiaro bret: would be good if people could just pull it from my foaf profile :p
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bret rhiaro: its not making into the h-entry http://glennjones.net/tools/microformats/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhiaro.co.uk%2F2015%2F02%2Fsocial-web-f2f&filters=&callback=
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rhiaro huh, I tested that before. I wonder where it's gone
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bret its in the page
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ben_thatmustbeme wants to wrap configs in to a group of configs for a specific app, so just select app
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@fortinux RT @pierreozoux: Ten use cases for a Personal Server #d14n #indieweb https://michielbdejong.com/2015/personal-server-use-cases https://kirilind.me/2015/ten-use-cases-for-a-personal-server-d14n-indieweb-2015personal-server-use-cases https://microblog.pierre-o.fr/2015/ten-use-cases-for-a-personal-server-d14n-indieweb-2015personal-server-use-cases (twitter.com/_/status/579022088293519360)
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rhiaro I have <span class="p-rsvp" value="yes"></span> inside the hentry
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ben_thatmustbeme all of this in his own created web page
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bret rhiaro: im not sure about all the details, see how I did it here: http://bret.io/2015/03/18/socialwg-f2f/
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bret does it have to be a data tag?
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tantek rhiaro: if you want to use span you have to put the value in the visible text
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rhiaro oh does it need to be data?
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tantek per example in the spec <span class="p-rsvp">yes</span>
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tantek OR it can be <data class="p-rsvp" value="yes">I'm totally GOING!!!</data> ;)
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bret oh i see, data tag for custom messages, and span for readable text
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bret i forgot about that
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rhiaro fixing
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tantek your choice
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tantek I use "going to" as my visible text in my RSVPs
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tantek e.g. <data class="p-rsvp" value="yes">going to</data>
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bret rhiaro: if you want to use foaf, you could maybe generate your h-card based off of your foaf data
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ben_thatmustbeme just published my changes to php-comments
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tantek ben_thatmustbeme++
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Loqi ben_thatmustbeme has 55 karma
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ben_thatmustbeme github.com/dissolve/php-comments
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tantek thank you Tim Owens for the demo!
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tantek also showed running Ghost
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tantek ...
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tantek next demo
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tantek ...
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tantek Barry Frost
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ben_thatmustbeme barryf: started with two aims, improve on contexts
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rhiaro fixed
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bret barryf: has a nice site :)
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ben_thatmustbeme owning own display of likes was second thing to work on
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bret rhiaro: woop
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bret "rsvp": [
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bret "yes"
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bret ],
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ben_thatmustbeme first, reply context... moved image next to name when in reply to, added block quote style
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bret hidden data is forgotten and rotton
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ben_thatmustbeme brought the arrow down to be beside his own content so you can see the distinction
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GWG Note to self...indent
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ben_thatmustbeme wow, permalinks are almost identical to feed view
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hongpong very clean style here
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ben_thatmustbeme remembers this and may have to steal some
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ben_thatmustbeme tantek: have you thought about a fixed position of your header, so that your icon is always beside the post
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ben_thatmustbeme next part was last.fm likes
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ben_thatmustbeme has been using it for 11 years, scrobbling likes of music though other sites
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kylewm bret: I just got a ping from you 2 minutes ago, did something change?
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rhiaro bret: huh, start time doesn't show up in the json, only end time
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bret kylewm: lol wtf?
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bret bit of a delay?
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bret rhiaro: which page?
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rhiaro http://glennjones.net/tools/microformats/?url=http%3A%2F%2Frhiaro.co.uk%2F2015%2F02%2Fsocial-web-f2f&filters=&callback=
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ben_thatmustbeme likes a page of last.fm, then can pull all the data in to his site and syndicates to last.fm
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ben_thatmustbeme tantek: are there permalinks for posts
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ben_thatmustbeme ?
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bret rhiaro: not sure, i have not played with h-event reply contexts before
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bret rhiaro: try looking at http://aaronparecki.com/replies/2013/09/21/3/indiewebcamp-indieweb-xoxo-xoxofest
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ben_thatmustbeme they somewhat do, but its not really accessable (looking at rss feed of "likes")
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bret thats aaronpk's rsvp with a reply context of an h-event
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tantek what is ownyourlikes?
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Loqi It looks like we don't have a page for "ownyourlikes" yet. Would you like to create it? https://indiewebcamp.com/wiki/index.php?action=edit&title=ownyourlikes&summary=prompted+by+tantek+https%3A%2F%2Findiewebcamp.com%2Firc%2F2015-03-20%2Fline%2F1426885319190
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ben_thatmustbeme ideally a simple site posssible that shows your last listen and you can just hit a like button that will post to your site (micropub) and then like on last.fm feed too
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bret rhiaro: more than I know off hand, I would peek at http://microformats.org/wiki/h-event and http://microformats.org/wiki/h-cite and ask tantek
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ben_thatmustbeme uses an app called 'workflow' that lets him share the url and directly send it to micropublish
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rhiaro bret: yeah, on it!
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ben_thatmustbeme next presentation: GWG
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ben_thatmustbeme working to refine his presentation a little
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ben_thatmustbeme testing with a fake checkin at the biggest ball of twine made by one man
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ben_thatmustbeme not as much done as he would like, but lays the foundation
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ben_thatmustbeme next demo
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ben_thatmustbeme *missed his name*
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ben_thatmustbeme working on getting webmentions working in drupal
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ben_thatmustbeme has them somewhat working but a little quirky
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ben_thatmustbeme indieweb.feidtdesign.com/
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ben_thatmustbeme indieweb.feidtdesign.com/node/2
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ben_thatmustbeme also created a drush (command line drupal tool) for webmentions
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ben_thatmustbeme wants to get his changes rolled back in to the module he based it on
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tantek https://indiewebcamp.com/Falcon##show%20webmention%20results
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@iamaegibson Use cases for a personal server #indieweb https://michielbdejong.com/2015/personal-server-use-cases http://aegibson.com/2015/use-cases-for-a-personal-server-indieweb2015personal-server-use-cases (twitter.com/_/status/579029057611939840)
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bret kylewm: did you get a ping?
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hongpong here are the vinculum latest commits i put on github (drupal webmentions) https://github.com/HongPong/vinculum
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kylewm bret: yes, 57 seconds ago
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bret not from the atom?
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kylewm nope
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bret woop!
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rhiaro yay! fixed my rsvp and h-card, so now I show up properly on https://aaronparecki.com/events/2015/03/17/1/socialwg-2015
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Loqi giggles
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@HongPong .@manarth i got much better results going for Webmentions posted em here, would be happy to work on official module https://github.com/HongPong/vinculum (twitter.com/_/status/579029444171452416)
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@HongPong at #indiewebcamp hack day got Webmentions working better for #Drupal https://github.com/HongPong/vinculum still needs theming but it's starting to Cook! (twitter.com/_/status/579029760979812352)
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bret GWG: only turn on skype when you need to
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bret its how you help kill that annoying client
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bret kylewm: just to confirm you got the html content of the post with the ping too right
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Loqi Welcome, indie-visitor! Set your nickname by typing /nick yourname
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bret ?
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bret rhiaro++ good work!
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Loqi rhiaro has 40 karma
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kylewm bret: probably, I am not making use of the content yet
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kylewm oh, just saw the request from julien51; just a sec I'll add a debug print
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bret nice work everyone
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KevinMarks so did I miss it all?
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KevinMarks timezones--
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Loqi timezones has -5 karma
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zachdonovan hello everyone!
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zachdonovan I'm just getting set up on the indie web for the first time
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KevinMarks welcome
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KevinMarks how are you doing it?
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zachdonovan Well, so far I've got an approximation of kylewm's red wind running on a digital ocean machine
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zachdonovan https://zachdonovan.net
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zachdonovan (not much over there)
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KevinMarks sent you a webmention
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KevinMarks :D
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tantek IndieWebCamp Cambridge is all cleaned up and we're closing up! Thanks everyone!
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zachdonovan KevinMarks: alright! I'll see if I can figure out if it worked :)
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KevinMarks didn't quite manage to remote attend well what with the citizenship thing
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snarfed1 KevinMarks++ for remembering his green card
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Loqi KevinMarks has 94 karma
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snarfed1 tantek++ (etc) for iwc cambridge!
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Loqi tantek has 169 karma
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bret zachdonovan++
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bret cool!
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Loqi zachdonovan has 1 karma
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bret kylewm: check for a ping. also you have another redwind user!
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zachdonovan KevinMarks: definitely registered, but I have no idea where to find it!
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zachdonovan shows up in the logs, though
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zachdonovan so I'll take that as a good sign
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zachdonovan bret: thanks! :)
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zachdonovan happy to have found y'all
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bret bunch of people at IWC Cambridge just signed off to go to dinner so it might be quiet in here for a bit. and I gotta run!
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bret happy you found it here!
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kylewm zachdonovan: hi :) are you running the qworker to process background tasks?
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zachdonovan kylewm: if I have to explicitly do anything to turn it on, probably not
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zachdonovan if not, a waiting task would show up in the DB, right?
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kylewm yep
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kylewm in the job table
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zachdonovan yep!
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zachdonovan not running
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kylewm you can have uwsgi manage it by adding to the ini file "attach-daemon: python qworker.py"
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zachdonovan awesome! thanks
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zachdonovan Although, err, I'm running gunicorn at present :)
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kylewm sure! nice job figuring it all out this far, sorry it's so poorly documented :) I will work on fixing that
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zachdonovan no worries!
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zachdonovan Maybe I can help
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snarfed kylewm++ for all the guerilla redwind adoption, fun to watch
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Loqi kylewm has 145 karma
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kylewm snarfed: I'm not quite sure what happened; it's like 3 new people in the last ~2 weeks?
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kylewm very exciting!
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kylewm zachdonovan++
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Loqi zachdonovan has 2 karma
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zachdonovan for me it was the right balance of "fun toys" and "nonthreatening"
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zachdonovan but I have to say, it's great stuff! I know there's not a ton of documentation, but the code is well organized!
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zachdonovan app credit to kylewm++
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zachdonovan *all
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kylewm thanks, too kind
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zachdonovan kylewm: while I have your attention, do you happen to know off the top of your head whether the Facebook Access Token is a user token or an app token?
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zachdonovan I assume app token
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kylewm Facebook App ID/Secret are the app tokens
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kylewm Facebook Access Token is the access token
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zachdonovan ah, alright, thanks!
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kylewm if you fill in the app tokens, save, then you should be able to click the Authorize Facebook link at the bottom to get an access token
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JHSheridan I'm making progress on Red Wind kylewm
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kylewm JHSheridan: glad to hear it!
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JHSheridan I am held up on one thing I just can't seem to find no matter where I search
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JHSheridan Where are you setting the theme?
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JHSheridan I see the two themes in there, oldskool and plain, but can't find in configs or DB where it is set
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kylewm DEFAULT_THEME in the config.py file
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kylewm mine is DEFAULT_THEME = 'oldskool'
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JHSheridan ahh... I see now.
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JHSheridan I think I'll add that to the template theme just to make it more apparent as well
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JHSheridan thanks... kyle++
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JHSheridan kylwm++
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Loqi kylwm has 2 karma
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JHSheridan lol
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zachdonovan kylewm++
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kylewm that'd be great, thanks
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Loqi kylewm has 146 karma
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kylewm hehe
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zachdonovan boom
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JHSheridan kylewm++
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Loqi dude
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zachdonovan hahaha
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JHSheridan Sorry loqi.... haha
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Loqi who, me?
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GWG Anyone here use OpenStreetMap for reverse geolocation?
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kylewm GWG: I do
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kylewm https://github.com/kylewm/redwind/blob/master/redwind/plugins/locations.py#L52
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GWG kylewm: You have there exactly what I was about to start on before hack day was over
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GWG mapping their properties to microformats 2
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kylewm cool, I borrowed that from barnabywalters
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kylewm barnabywalters++
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Loqi barnabywalters has 79 karma
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GWG Saves me time
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tantek good evening #indiewebcamp from Toscanini's - note they have free wifi and power outlets. And ice cream. But that's not free. Except for the samples.
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@t First day of Spring 2015 #IndieWebCamp @MIT wrapped. Snow in Cambridge. Free wifi & power @Tosci. And ice ... http://tantek.com/2015/079/t3/first-day-spring-indiewebcamp-wrapped (twitter.com/_/status/579054451182297089)
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@rhiaro RT @t: First day of Spring 2015 #IndieWebCamp @MIT wrapped. Snow in Cambridge. Free wifi & power @Tosci. And ice ... http://tantek.com/2015/079/t3/first-day-spring-indiewebcamp-wrapped (twitter.com/_/status/579054773883777024)
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GWG tantek: You are at an ice cream shop?
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tantek GWG yes - we decided to eat ice cream before dinner because it was snowing.
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GWG Umm..okay
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bret tantek: let me know if you have any q's about those two PRs I sent you for cassis
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tantek bret - ok - I will take a look at them when I am less cognitively depleted.
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bret hah! i figured.... been there myself. enjoy your icecream!
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tantek GWG, you're welcome to come by, we're critiquing Guidelines for Dublin Core Application Profiles, not to be confused with Dublin Core Application Profile Guidelines.
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kylewm bret: if the exports.auto_link bit is js-only, you might consider wrapping it in if (js()) { ... }
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bret oh yeah good point
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GWG tantek: Is it still snowing?
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kylewm bret: actually couldn't you put the exports in a separate .js file and use it as a shim when building the module?
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bret everything is trapped inside each file until you export it
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kylewm ahh, gotcha
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bret there might be some kind of shimming tool thoigh
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bret that would be easier tbh
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bret stares at eval with an evil dirty thought
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bret >:]
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@kirilind Yes: Codestop before #oslabs15 - looking forward to #IndieWebCamp Düsseldorf on 9-10 May! https://kirilind.me/2015/yes-codestop-before-oslabs15---looking-forward-to-indiewebcamp-dsseldorf (twitter.com/_/status/579061889021411328)
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Loqi [mention] kirilind RSVPed yes to https://indiewebcamp.com/2015/Germany/Guest_List (https://kirilind.me/2015/yes-codestop-before-oslabs15---looking-forward-to-indiewebcamp-dsseldorf)
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GWG I think I'm going to eat at that fish place next door to the hotel and come back here and do more location stuff
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GWG Indiewebcamp continues
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bret ok i was rightfully shamed out of using eval, that would be a bad idea
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bret kylewm: i might be able to use https://github.com/chrisdickinson/scoped
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kylewm bret: looks a little crazy :)
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auli.haldjas.org edited /2015/Germany/Guest_List (+271) "/* Participants */" (view diff)
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tantek GWG, sounds tasty and productive
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tantek also there is a Legal Seafood near your hotel, you had asked about that earlier
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GWG tantek: That is the fish place next to my hotel.
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tantek GWG, I went there last May I think. It's excellent if a bit pricey. Certainly worth going to once for the experience. Secondary experiences I leave up to your opinion of your first experience.
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GWG tantek: I am sitting in it now. Either way, after that, I want to get my location code to where it is usable.
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tantek That sounds awesome.