User talk:Frettie

Hello Frettie! It looks like you are commonly setting the "sex or gender" property based on the grammatical gender used for a person at the Czech National Authority Database. While this usually works fine, it causes errors for non-binary people, as the Czech language only uses 2 grammatical genders for people. I'm not sure if there is any good solution for this other than not setting "sex or gender". It may be better to wait and let someone set it based on a better reference.

Hi @Nosferattus – do you have some examples of non-binary people of Czech National Authority Database? I'll check it and i want to make it better! Thanks! --~~~~

Here are a few examples:

• https://aleph.nkp.cz/F/?func=find-c&local_base=aut&ccl_term=ica=mub20211105782 (spisovatelky)
• https://aleph.nkp.cz/F/?func=find-c&local_base=aut&ccl_term=ica=xx0304540 (spisovatelky)
• https://aleph.nkp.cz/F/?func=find-c&local_base=aut&ccl_term=ica=mub2015867526 (spisovatel and spisovatelé)

The first example is Kate Bornstein who has identified as non-binary for a decade or so and is very well-known for being non-binary. For the other two, it's possible their gender identity wasn't known or was different when the entries were created.

Hi, hm, there are problems in authority DB of National Library and / or czech language (spisovatelky/spisovatelka as women/woman, spisovatelé/spisovatel as men/man). So when i looked at Kate Bornstein – There is merged itemhttps://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q105970034&oldid=1382886499 – and there is only date and NK ČR ID. If you look at MARC record detail (https://aleph.nkp.cz/F/B99JQS1NUPLPMRIQTBFC75NCKUK21JF9X77CDCB9481GN1SPYV-42677?func=full-set-set&set_number=057357&set_entry=000001&format=001) – there is field 375a – žena (woman). So if there is not filled or there is not "žena" or "muž", there is not filled.

We can discuss methodology with NKČR – but there is actually not gender set to non-binary people – you can check this – https://autority.nkp.cz/jmenne-autority/metodicke-materialy/metodika-jmena-cvicne-2#pole375

But i can check it when i creating items manually and some time by descriptions unset gender or set it corrected. Thanks!

Thanks for looking into it! It's good to know that NKČR isn't explicitly setting gender in these cases. The edit that brought this issue to my attention was actually where you created the item for A. K. Mulford. In that edit, P21 is set to female with the reference given as https://aleph.nkp.cz/F/?func=find-c&local_base=aut&ccl_term=ica=xx0304540. Do you think that was just based on the grammatical gender of spisovatelky? No criticism intended, just hoping to figure out how to avoid these errors in the future :)

Hi, no, its based by men / women in 375a MARC field. So in our tables (Wikidata:WikiProject Czech Republic/New authorities) are descriptions, where some details are appended – sometime there are info about pseudonymes etc, maybe there will be some info about gender. After this, ill correct it after create.

Hi @Nosferattus – what do you think about this new created item – Q130339912 – its created from NK ČR authorities and there is not filled gender (in NK ČR DB). Is it correct?

Yes, that looks correct. Thanks for explaining to me about 375a. I will look for that in the future and send NKČR requests for corrections when needed. Cheers!

Hi! I see a few cases in which occupazione (P106)papa (Q19546) has been added by FrettieBot with source NKC; however, this is redundant in comparison with carica ricoperta (P39)papa (Q19546), which also has the qualifiers for start end etc. I have removed the P106 statements; could you assure they won't be added again? Thanks as always!

Hi @Epìdosis – i think, that it is ok already – for popes and some other "in function" cases there is existing solution.

https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q125295386&action=history - when you created that item, the contained ISNI was already at https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q18912045&oldid=2046163419

At least you should merge such cases afterwards.

Hi, i am sorry, if i found the same people, i merging that. Thanks. I created thousands items, i know it. --~~~~

Same here https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q124645313&action=history - it is good to have the connection to NKČR

Maybe before import refresh Property_talk:P213/Duplicates/humans and after import refresh again - then it is more clear how many new duplicates have been created.

Very good NKČR has ISNI and you import it, so we have more chance to find duplicates. Best regards

Shouldn't the "File:Uhry-znak chronicon.jpg" in Adelaide av Ungern (Q2457515) be in bild av heraldiskt vapen (P94) not in bild (P18)? I added it to bild av heraldiskt vapen (P94) but it should be removed from bild (P18). Maundwiki (disk) 11:54, 15 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi, i agree. --~~~~

Hi! Why js20010125049 has been added to Oleh Olehovyč Kandyba (Q25442482) on 25 May although it does not contain that Wikidata ID (because it was removed from it on 20 May)? Thanks!

Hi, it's strange. Maybe because ISNI in NK ČR record? But even that's unlikely.

As of the 25 May surely js20010125049 did not contain a reference to Wikidata item Oleh Olehovyč Kandyba (Q25442482); maybe the bot retrieved it before 25 May (in this specific case, before 20 May when the Wikidata item was removed)?

Yes, but there is ISNI field in js20010125049 – and we can add " js20010125049" to WD by ISNI field in WD item.

This is strange: js20010125049 contains ISNI 0000000109914931, whilst the Wikidata item before last bot addition contained ISNI 0000000074945489, so the two ISNIs did not match. Anyway, removing now NKC and ISNI from the item should be safe, right?

Hm, it is strange ...

I think so, it may be correct way.

Hi! For early-modern printers often women are registered as "widow of X"; however, vedova di Johann Nikolaus Gerlach (Q124640128) was imported just as "Johann Nikolaus Gerlach", omitting the fundamental indication "vdova"; this may lead to wrong merges and other types of confusion. The indication "vdova" should never be omitted; and, if possible, already existing items should be checked and their labels edited adding missing "vdova". Thanks as always!

Hi, i tried to write correct czech label "vdova po XY", its similar "widow of XY", i try to check when insert similar records. Thanks!

Thanks, this is surely better; if possible, take a look also on previously imported items ;-)

Hello, your recent batch with the tool Quickstatements (1710581543492) added some values to the property skådespelare (P161) from the ČSFD database. However, this database doesn't differentiate between skådespelare (P161) and röstskådespelare (P725) which duplicated the values on items such as Odysseus a hvězdy (Q931721). Now, I've reverted your edits on this item, but do check your edits to see if this hasn't created more work for others and be cautious in the future.

Thanks

Thanks, that is very special case of movie.

Hello, Can you please use Q11569986 rather than Q329439 when you find "rytiny" on Czech authorities? First one refers to printmakers artists ; second one to craftsmen. Example with Alix (see history of Q3573440: the information is duplicated, as the source is already used for Q11569986 occupation). It is a lot of work to correct these assertions. Thank you!

I think, that is correct setup, Q3573440 (Alix) has in NKČR "rytci" (engraver – Q329439). @Vojtěch Dostál – what do you think?

Hello, no, as I said, Q329439 refers to craftmen who worked metal to do some decoration on metal or medals. And Q11569986 refers to artists (printmakers) who work metal plates to produce art prints. 99% of Q329439 uses after the Czech authority notice are wrong...

Oh, i see! Thanks! I moved "tiskař" from Q329439 to Q11569986.

Did you move all usages? I can do that

I didn't.

I will do it when I have some time.

Thank you very much, both of you :)

@Daehan There's 14 statements where the claim is supported by another reference. What should be done about these? Also moved?

https://w.wiki/9SWs

Hello @Vojtěch Dostál, I checked them, and they are all printmakers, yes.

An additional request, maybe. When you get a source (P854) from https://cs.isabart.org, shouldn't P248 be Q107456632 instead of Q10855166 ? (Example here: Q6149252)

Just to be clear, regarding the 14 statements, there should not be Q329439 as an occupation: they all are Q11569986 and the sources used for the first should actually be added to the second. Thanks!

OK, I will fix all statements.

As for Abart, I can't help unfortunately. Tools available to me cannot edit references so easily. But I agree.

OK, thank you for everything, @Vojtěch Dostál !