Wikidata:Property proposal/Black Lunch Table ID

Originally proposed at Wikidata:Property proposal/Authority control

Motivation

This is a Wikipedia initiative that focuses on Visual artists of the African diaspora. It a crowd-sourced task list that can't be identified by statements because of the diversity of the background within their community, but they can be identified by this ID. BrillLyle (talk) 18:40, 15 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion

•  Support. GerardM (talk) 05:06, 21 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
•  Comment @BrillLyle: how far is the project from having a website presence or some other online resource? This prop isn't much good if you can't specify a Formatter URL (i.e. links to the project) --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 07:25, 21 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Vladimir Alexiev: The task list is here and there's a spreadsheet here; it's not a traditional ID in the sense it doesn't have a URL with a unique identifier. Instead it would be a unique identifier used to run queries. It will be highly functional for location and gender queries, as the initiative is being conducted all over North America with plans to expand it internationally. -- Erika aka BrillLyle (talk) 07:36, 21 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  •  Oppose @BrillLyle: Ok, so this is a table with 903 entries and little extra info (eg birth & residence country, but I assume you'll add that to WD eventually). So the table serves to manage work (which entry has what data), not to hold data. I fully know why you need this (you prefer to manage the work of your project on WD rather than on some stray google sheet), and we have similar needs (eg for the Europeana Food and Drink (Q19723898) and European Holocaust Research Infrastructure (Q21755493) projects). But adding a per-project ID property, which does not lead to more data, and is not subject to coreferencing (because people won't care to link to your table if you don't have extra data), is not the solution. Instead, I'll propose a generic "identifier" property. --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 09:53, 23 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    • @Vladimir Alexiev: Your assumptions are based on what? It is EXACTLY to add data to these items because that will allow for queries; to show how well the project is doing, to see the gender ration. So you propose "something" but no details.. Sorry, but you provide no substantial argument to go on you are against but have no alternative. GerardM (talk) 10:43, 23 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

@GerardM, BrillLyle: My understanding is that the project will add data to WD, it won't build its own database or website. So the identifier is needed for the project to find the items on WD, not the other way around. I don't see this added on Mix-n-Match because the project is building a complete coreference table anyway. I proposed Wikidata:Property proposal/Identifier that will allow the project to track, yet won't add a property that does not lead to extra data outside WD. Please support that proposal --Vladimir Alexiev (talk) 15:46, 23 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

We do want the same mechanism as used for external sources that does not show. Your proposal may work and when it is accepted this proposal may be redundant. Any time frame? Sooner is better! Thanks, GerardM (talk) 16:03, 23 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

 Comment @Vladimir Alexiev: We are creating a database actually on Google sheets. And the output would be a Wikidata table or list that would benefit Wikipedia and Wikidatans alike. It would build the website Wikipedia:Meetup/Black Lunch Table actually. It's not extra data as it is significantly contributing to Wikidata, as the crowdsourced list would be a database, in a sense, on Wikidata. It would be positive for both Wikidata as well as various initiatives on Wikipedia trying to address diversity and gender gap. Yes, it's a creative and non-traditional ID, but it is within the scope of Wikidata, I believe, and could be a super positive bridge between Wikipedia and Wikidata. More Wikipedians will have exposure to Wikidata this way -- and even possibly vice versa. I see it as a constructive helpful thing. I know that Magnus' Mix-n-Match has functionality but for separate initiatives how does that allow for granular querying? -- Erika aka BrillLyle (talk) 18:37, 23 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]

• @BrillLyle, has the BLT project looked at using toollabs:mix-n-match for Wikipedia:Meetup/Black Lunch Table/Lists of Articles? It'll help associate the list of names with QIDs, and should save some manual association time. czar 19:19, 24 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
•  Oppose per Vladimir Alexiev. Use QID, or use catalog code (P528)/ catalog (P972). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 21:03, 24 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • Catalog code is not what I want. I am more interested in the Catalog. The code is additional. Thanks, GerardM (talk) 08:05, 26 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    • The description, allowed-value pattern, and the example (albeit incomplete) all suggest this is a for a catalogue code. Nonetheless, my suggestion includes catalog code (P528). Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 21:03, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
•  Support. Let us have a big tent. ChristianKl (talk) 07:54, 27 February 2017 (UTC)[reply]
•  Oppose Seems just as identifier for WikiProject on enwiki. There is no benefit for WD. If you have data in Google Sheet, just insert them directly to WikiData.--Jklamo (talk) 18:07, 4 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
•  Oppose per above. Multichill (talk) 21:00, 15 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
• @Pigsonthewing, Multichill, BrillLyle, GerardM, Vladimir Alexiev:Not done, no consensus for creation of the property. It might be also worthwhile to look at the recently created diaspora (P3833). ChristianKl (talk) 12:04, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  • @Pigsonthewing, Multichill, BrillLyle, ChristianKl, Vladimir Alexiev: This proposal does indeed have no merit. The current solution of using "catalog" with "Black Lunch Table" works really well. Thanks, GerardM (talk) 12:09, 21 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]