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== Missing Criticism ==
material from Q Ship, intergrate as needed.
 
When you read the article you can get the idea that Q-Ships were a perfectly legal, brilliant idea to counter the treat of german submarines. The british were certainly in desperation yet the usage of concealed warships was considered a warcrime by the maritime war of these days, which explains why it was "one of the most closely guarded secrets of the war." German submarines operated under the prize rules which demanded that every merchant vessel had to be stopped, it's cargo checked and only if it was transporting contraband it was allowed to be sunk, after the crew was on lifeboats in safe distance, usually combined with an SOS. Only then the ship was sunk by using the deck cannon to save precious torpedoes. It was the utopia of a civilized warfare without unnecessary casualities. The result of the Q-ship usage was that the war on sea got noteworthy brutalized on both sides, leading to the unconditional submarine warfare with submarines ignoring the prize rule by just firing without warning, out of paranoia to not make themselves a victim to Q-ships. The invention of Q-ships can be seen as a premise which might have been a main reason for the Lusitania incident that would follow in May 1915. Another example worth mentioning in this article were the Baralong incidents. The HMS Baralong sunk 2 submarines by sailing under US flag and thus appearing as a neutral ship. After U-27 was sunk every surviving german sailor, still swimming in the sea or on board of the Nicosian was shot by the crew of the Baralong under order of it's commanding officer Lieutenant Godfrey Herbert. <small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/188.108.151.179|188.108.151.179]] ([[User talk:188.108.151.179|talk]]) 13:28, 26 September 2015 (UTC)</small><!-- Template:Unsigned IP --> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
A '''Q-ship''' is a decoy vessel disguised as a merchant or non-military ship, but actually bearing concealed weapons. Q-ships were used by the British in [[World War I]] and [[World War II]] to lure and occasionally destroy German [[U-boat]]s.
: I agree with this edit. Therefor I deleted one phrase in the lemma. --[[User:Orik|Orik]] ([[User talk:Orik|talk]]) 13:29, 12 March 2016 (UTC)
 
: I am concerned by this criticism. If it is true, then the article definitely ought to be edited to say so.
A Q-ship would typically ply the merchant shipping lanes, clearly marked as a civilian vessel, and occasionally flying neutral colors. When a U-boat surfaced to fire upon the ship, the Q-ship crew would run up the white ensign and open fire on the enemy submarine. Unfortunately, this tactic met with only partial success. Often, submarines would torpedo the ships from a distance, or approach them so cautiously as to negate the Q-ships advantage.
[[User:IceDragon64|IceDragon64]] ([[User talk:IceDragon64|talk]]) 20:10, 25 March 2018 (UTC)
 
:I was about to write a similar criticism--if this was a war crime (and someone know which maritime treaty it violated) this is a *huge* oversight, one which arguably gives a different cast to the entire war (at least in terms of the U.S.'s entry into it). [[User:Historian932|Historian932]] ([[User talk:Historian932|talk]]) 19:54, 3 April 2018 (UTC)
One of the earliest Q-ships to successfully destroy an enemy submarine was a converted fishing vessel extravagantly titled "His Majesty's Armed Smack ''Inverlyon''". Despite the grand title, the ship in question was simply an unpowered sailing craft fitted with a tiny 47mm cannon. In [[1915]], the ''Inverlyon'' encountered a small [[UB-1]] type U-boat while masquerading as an active fishing vessel near [[Great Yarmouth, England|Great Yarmouth]]. The submarine, christened "UB-4", was commanded by Leutenant zur See Karl Gross. When it approached the ''Inverlyon'', presumably with the intention of boarding the smack and sinking it, the British crew opened fire. The submarine upended and sank, killing the entire German crew.
 
::It's quite evidently british propaganda. It's all over Wikipedia, really. The english are often portrayed as the bad guys on non-english entries, but even there the truth is "being improved" in creative ways. The Q ships were a ruse of war designed to trick the germans into killing innocent civilians to sway public opinion against them; nothing more.
Sources:
[[Special:Contributions/190.46.205.93|190.46.205.93]] ([[User talk:190.46.205.93|talk]]) 22:44, 3 January 2020 (UTC)
 
If it was "illegal" (as against immoral etc.), you should state what article of international law it infringed. The German U-boats certainly didn't chivalrously save all the crew of merchant ships before sinking them, from early in the war. For instance, on 10 April 1915 the British steamer Harpalyce was torpedoed without warning by SM UB-4 with loss of life. The submarine fired torpedoes at 3 other ships at the same time, all without warning, and claimed all sunk, but only Harpalyce was lost. SM UB-4 was later sunk by a Q-ship.
http://www.ku.edu/~kansite/ww_one/naval/ub4.htm
Criticism of the use of Q-ships could well be justified, naturally. But we need the proper references. As for the statement that its "illegality" explains why it was "one of the most closely guarded secrets of the war", that's clearly nonsense. It was a closely guarded secret for the obvious reason that the British didn't want the Germans to know about the decoy ships because they would have lost something of their effectiveness. I believe they did in fact become known to the Germans quite soon, from reports of surviving U-boats attacked by them, but that's another matter [[User:METRANGOLO1|METRANGOLO1]] ([[User talk:METRANGOLO1|talk]]) 18:21, 17 October 2020 (UTC)
 
O, those chivalrous Germans! <!-- Template:Unsigned IP --><small class="autosigned">—&nbsp;Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|unsigned]] comment added by [[Special:Contributions/82.15.39.58|82.15.39.58]] ([[User talk:82.15.39.58#top|talk]]) 07:36, 18 October 2020 (UTC)</small> <!--Autosigned by SineBot-->
I've corrected the [[U-boats]] link to [[U-boat]]s, to link to the [[U-boat]] entry, in the above, as I assume that must be where it should link to. [[User:Silverfish|Silverfish]] 20:31, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
 
I've capitalised and linked "Royal Navy" [[User:Epeeist smudge|Epeeist smudge]] 11:24, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
 
:Nice theory but it just isn't true. The U-boats were instructed to sink ships without warning *before* Q-ships. Q-ships was a response to unrestricted submarine warfare, not the other way round. The first Baralong incident was probably a war crime but ruse de guerre isn't generally, and also statistically crew from U-boats sunk by Q-ships actually had a better chance of surviving than those sunk by other methods. [[User:Fangz|Fangz]] ([[User talk:Fangz|talk]]) 11:59, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
== Bond's Q ==▼
::Besides the Germans did the same thing. If you disguise your commerce raiders as neutral civilian craft, you can hardly complain about ships that did the same thing but targeting military vessels, as opposed to civilian ones. [[Special:Contributions/82.2.239.38|82.2.239.38]] ([[User talk:82.2.239.38|talk]]) 15:53, 18 April 2024 (UTC)
I've added reference to [[James Bond]]'s Q -- [[User:Kschang77|Kschang77]] 04:13, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
:Unfortunately, that's not really relevant to the subject at hand. The Bond agents are referred to by letter, and it is highly dubious there is any connection. --[[User:Eyrian|Eyrian]] 07:15, 15 December 2006 (UTC)
 
I think what Orik and Historian and ice Dragon etc. are trying to say is that it was illegal when the British did it but perfectly legal when the Germans did it.[[User:METRANGOLO1|METRANGOLO1]] ([[User talk:METRANGOLO1|talk]]) 13:23, 28 September 2024 (UTC)
==Q-ships and the Hague Conventions==
 
== External links modified ==
I don't know where this can be added into the article, but Q-ships where a violation of the laws of war, namely Article 2 of Section 7 from the Hague Conventions of 1907, namely ''"Merchant ships converted into war-ships must bear the external marks which distinguish the war-ships of their nationality."'' I feel this should be added into the article, perhaps in the lead, but I was wondering about consensus on this matter before adding it, and where in the rest of the article it can be elaborated upon.
 
Hello fellow Wikipedians,
--[[User:Jadger|Jadger]] 23:22, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
:I think this would be an excellent addition to the article, probably under a new heading "Q-ships and international law". --[[User:Eyrian|Eyrian]] 23:46, 17 January 2007 (UTC)
 
I have just modified {{plural:1|one external link|1 external links}} on [[Q-ship]]. Please take a moment to review [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?diff=prev&oldid=730891774 my edit]. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit [[User:Cyberpower678/FaQs#InternetArchiveBot|this simple FaQ]] for additional information. I made the following changes:
::''the external marks which distinguish the war-ships of their nationality'' means the appropriate flags, which have to be raised before attacking, though not necessarily very long before. A warship with the profile of a merchant ship, raising war flags at the last moment, is a legitimate ''ruse de guerre''. [[User:Mesoso|Mesoso]] 15:34, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
*Added archive http://web.archive.org/web/20130519125545/http://www.mightyseas.co.uk:80/marhist/furness/ashburners/q23.htm to http://www.mightyseas.co.uk/marhist/furness/ashburners/q23.htm
 
When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the ''checked'' parameter below to '''true''' or '''failed''' to let others know (documentation at {{tlx|Sourcecheck}}).
and do you have any evidence that the war flags were raised before attack EVERY single time? please cite a source that says they weren't a violation of the Hague convention.
 
{{sourcecheck|checked=false}}
--[[User:Jadger|Jadger]] 17:47, 23 March 2007 (UTC)
 
Cheers.—[[User:InternetArchiveBot|'''<span style="color:darkgrey;font-family:monospace">InternetArchiveBot</span>''']] <span style="color:green;font-family:Rockwell">([[User talk:InternetArchiveBot|Report bug]])</span> 16:15, 21 July 2016 (UTC)
No, YOU must cite a source which says they were a violation, since YOU are making the assertion.
 
== WAS Gold Star a Q-ship? ==
IF ever war flags were not raised before attack, that makes ''not raising war flags'', on that particular (hypothetical) occasion, a war crime, not the use of a boat with a civilian profile.
 
Although it was an armed merchant ship, that alone does not make it a Q ship, yet it is described as such both here and on its own Page. I am tempted to remove the paragraph all together. Can anyone find evidence that it was armed secretly, in order to attract surface attack by submarine?
[[User:Mesoso|Mesoso]] 13:13, 27 March 2007 (UTC)
 
[[User:IceDragon64|IceDragon64]] ([[User talk:IceDragon64|talk]]) 19:50, 25 March 2018 (UTC)
 
:I support removing Gold Star from this page. She was more like a [[spy ship]] rather than Q-ship. [[User:MKFI|MKFI]] ([[User talk:MKFI|talk]]) 18:08, 22 May 2019 (UTC)
 
::Agree entirely. I've changed the description in the ship's page and will move the section to Spy ship article.[[User:Cosmicdense|Cosmicdense]] ([[User talk:Cosmicdense|talk]]) 00:15, 2 October 2020 (UTC)
 
▲== Bond's QNaming ==
 
After Queenstown? I thought it was a bad pun on 'ship of the line' --- a queue-ship, geddit? [[Special:Contributions/157.131.93.97|157.131.93.97]] ([[User talk:157.131.93.97|talk]]) 19:58, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
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